# NJ OAG Sues 2 NJ FFL's for selling rifle ammunition without requiring ID **URL:** \ **Category:** NJ & Federal Gun Laws and Activism\ **Tags:** nj-gun-law\ **Created:** [November 13, 2024, 7:39pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507 "2024-11-13T19:39:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/dirtydigz/32/2609_2.png) [@DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/u/DirtyDigz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 7:39pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/1 "2024-11-13T19:39:29Z")
[https://www.njoag.gov/ag-platkin-acts-against-gun-stores-for-repeated-unlawful-sales-to-unverified-buyers/](https://www.njoag.gov/ag-platkin-acts-against-gun-stores-for-repeated-unlawful-sales-to-unverified-buyers/) > … Earlier this year, investigators from SAFE visited these stores and made purchases with cash. > > In March 2024, Butch’s Gun World sold a 20-round box of .223 caliber ammunition—a high-velocity, military-standard rifle ammunition often used in AR-15-style rifles—and a handgun ammunition magazine to a first-time customer. > > In June 2024, a different Butch’s salesperson sold a 1,000-round case of .223 caliber ammunition to a different first-time customer. > > In March 2024, a salesperson at Point Blank Guns and Ammo sold a handgun ammunition magazine to a first-time buyer. > > In May 2024, a Point Blank Guns and Ammo salesperson sold a 1,000-round case of .223 caliber ammunition to a different first-time customer. > > In each instance, the stores did not ask to see any type of identification, permit, or credential of the purchaser. Instead, the stores made sales—including of vast quantities of lethal ammunition for cash—without any apparent steps to exclude sales to prohibited firearms possessors. … ---
**Author:** ![DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/dirtydigz/32/2609_2.png) [@DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/u/DirtyDigz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 7:45pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/2 "2024-11-13T19:45:18Z")
Hope these FFL’s fight the charges - AFAIK there is no NJ law that requires verification of non-prohibited status for sale of “long gun” ammo. ---
**Author:** ![scorpio64](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/scorpio64/32/6025_2.png) [@scorpio64](https://njgunforums.net/u/scorpio64)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 7:55pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/3 "2024-11-13T19:55:41Z")
> [@DirtyDigz](#): > > a 20-round box of .223 caliber ammunition—a high-velocity, military-standard rifle ammunition often used in AR-15-style rifles I must have missed the memo. When did .223 become standard for NATO? > [@DirtyDigz](#): > > a handgun ammunition magazine to a first-time customer. When did mags become regulated? > [@DirtyDigz](#): > > AFAIK there is no NJ law requirement that requires verification of non-prohibited status for sale of “long gun” ammo. Didn’t beaverpuss pass a law that all ammo sales had to show FPID. About a couple years ago all the online retailers started asking for FPID for long gun ammo. Something about it being interchangable with pistols like 22lr. I placed an order with a seller a couple years ago for 22lr and they demanded a FPID and I said “what part of long RIFLE are you confused about” and the response was that NJ laws were a mine field and they just started demanding an FPID for all transactions just to avoid expensive hassles later down the line. That’s when I said thank you for being a pussy and helping the left fuck us in the ass. I wonder why I didn’t get a reply 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/dirtydigz/32/2609_2.png) [@DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/u/DirtyDigz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 8:04pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/4 "2024-11-13T20:04:17Z")
> [@scorpio64](#): > > Didn’t beaverpuss pass a law that all ammo sales had to show FPID. Not that I’m aware of. They did pass a recent law requiring FFL’s to log ammo sales and report \>=1k rounds sales to NJSP. > [@scorpio64](#): > > About a couple years ago all the online retailers started asking for FPID for long gun ammo. Something about it being interchangable with pistols like 22lr. I believe that “standard” came about as a general industry CYA when dealing with NJ customers, not because of any new law. Under Murphy both Grewal and Platkin have been aggressive going after out-of-state firearm/accessories retailers. > [@scorpio64](#): > > I placed an order with a seller a couple years ago for 22lr and they demanded a FPID and I said “what part of long RIFLE are you confused about” and the response was that NJ laws were a mine field and they just started demanding an FPID for all transactions just to avoid expensive hassles later down the line I don’t blame the sellers. NJ is probably \<10% of their sales, while being \>\>\>\>10% of their potential litigation risk. Why even bother with the fine details of NJ law in that case? ---
**Author:** ![10X](https://njgunforums.net/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/1/c37758/32.png) [@10X](https://njgunforums.net/u/10X)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 8:12pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/5 "2024-11-13T20:12:25Z")
> [@DirtyDigz](#): > > Not that I’m aware of. They did pass a recent law requiring FFL’s to log ammo sales and report \>1k rounds sales to NJSP. So the AG decided to round up 1000 to 1001, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/dirtydigz/32/2609_2.png) [@DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/u/DirtyDigz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 8:32pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/6 "2024-11-13T20:32:59Z")
> [@10X](#): > > So the AG decided to round up 1000 to 1001, apparently. Edited my prior post. I think the law was “1,000 rounds or more” ---
**Author:** ![SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/smokenclays/32/2247_2.png) [@SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/u/SmokenClays)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 8:56pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/7 "2024-11-13T20:56:06Z")
I believe it was as of February 2023 that they started logging sales of ALL ammo regardless of quantity/caliber/gauge. There are AR and shotgun ‘pistols’ so guess what, all ammo is considered pistol ammo so joke’s on us! As far as I understand online retailers are only required to verify you have a valid ID, unless they are in NJ I don’t believe they have any logging/reporting requirement. The magazine thing… umm what? I don’t know what to say on that. Is this some recent change I am unaware of? I have bought pistol mags from all over and never asked for FID. ---
**Author:** ![10X](https://njgunforums.net/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/1/c37758/32.png) [@10X](https://njgunforums.net/u/10X)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 9:16pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/8 "2024-11-13T21:16:02Z")
> [@DirtyDigz](#): > > Edited my prior post. I think the law was “1,000 rounds or more” Ah, ok. I figured that since the AG is so bad at constitutional law, it wasn’t much of a stretch to also assume he’s bad at math. ---
**Author:** ![Sniper](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/sniper/32/187_2.png) [@Sniper](https://njgunforums.net/u/Sniper)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2024, 9:43pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/9 "2024-11-13T21:43:40Z")
> [@DirtyDigz](#): > > vast quantities of lethal ammunition LOL… when did .223 become “lethal”?? You would think a AG understands calibers. Or, to put it another way, isn’t ALL ammo lethal? ---
**Author:** ![Handyman](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/handyman/32/58_2.png) [@Handyman](https://njgunforums.net/u/Handyman)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 1:13am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/10 "2024-11-14T01:13:40Z")
> [@scorpio64](#): > > That’s when I said thank you for being a pussy and helping the left Fudge "Only, I didn’t say fudge” us in the ass. I wonder why I didn’t get a reply 🤔 I’ll get you a book for Christmas: ![image](https://njgunforums.net/uploads/default/original/1X/29e9ad9ef22f3e39a30bb008624f946768cfa411.png) ---
**Author:** ![brucin](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/brucin/32/35_2.png) [@brucin](https://njgunforums.net/u/brucin)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 3:36am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/11 "2024-11-14T03:36:34Z")
> [@SmokenClays](#): > > There are AR and shotgun ‘pistols’ so guess what, all ammo is considered pistol ammo so joke’s on us! I want to buy one of those AR pistols where in NJ can I purchase one? I’d like to know. If you can’t buy the pistol then it’s not pistol ammo. ---
**Author:** ![SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/smokenclays/32/2247_2.png) [@SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/u/SmokenClays)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 4:13am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/12 "2024-11-14T04:13:32Z")
> [@brucin](#): > > I want to buy one of those AR pistols where in NJ can I purchase one? > **[Dark Storm DS-15 Typhoon Fixed Magazine 5.56 Pistol Black DS15-TYP-FP5-BLK](https://www.dark-storm.com/dsi/ds-15/ds-15-typhoon-rifles/dark-storm-ds-15-typhoon-fixed-magazine-5.56-pistol-black/)** > > Dark Storm DS-15 Typhoon Fixed Magazine 5.56 Pistol Black DS15-TYP-FP5-BLK $1295 ![image](https://njgunforums.net/uploads/default/original/1X/22dcca37924ed8031f2ba1d0bd290bf62eb13c7a.png) You will need a pistol permit but can have it shipped to your FFL ---
**Author:** ![SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/smokenclays/32/2247_2.png) [@SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/u/SmokenClays)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 4:31am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/13 "2024-11-14T04:31:42Z")
Here’s a .223 single shot option: [https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1066672875](https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1066672875) ![image](https://njgunforums.net/uploads/default/original/1X/4d5746b5b10b62e30725b3f86e16257da47a3dd5.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![Grima](https://njgunforums.net/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/g/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Grima](https://njgunforums.net/u/Grima)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 6:25pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/14 "2024-11-14T18:25:25Z")
> [@DirtyDigz](#): > > I don’t blame the sellers. NJ is probably \<10% of their sales, while being \>\>\>\>10% of their potential litigation risk. Why even bother with the fine details of NJ law in that case? I have a buddy who is RPO who has property in SC. He has had gun dealers there refuse to sell him items that are not NJ-compliant. When he has questioned them, they agree that he is able to legally buy and possess those items in SC, but regardless, they aren’t selling them to him, to prevent any potential indemnity or liability. It does sometimes suck to be the resident of a marxist state. ---
**Author:** ![CMJeepster](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/cmjeepster/32/622_2.png) [@CMJeepster](https://njgunforums.net/u/CMJeepster)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2024, 8:02pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/15 "2024-11-14T20:02:39Z")
Fishing anyone? ---
**Author:** ![brucin](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/brucin/32/35_2.png) [@brucin](https://njgunforums.net/u/brucin)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2024, 12:26am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/16 "2024-11-15T00:26:56Z")
> [@SmokenClays](#): > > You will need a pistol permit but can have it shipped to your FFL I thought any pistol with a magazine separate from the grip that weighed more than 50 oz unloaded was banned period… I was being facetious, you shouldn’t be able charge someone with selling pistol ammo if the pistol can’t be sold in the state. ---
**Author:** ![SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/smokenclays/32/2247_2.png) [@SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/u/SmokenClays)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2024, 12:46am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/17 "2024-11-15T00:46:04Z")
I’m not sure… only reason I know about AR pistol w/ fixed mag being an option is someone had one at the range a year or so ago and the guy claimed to have purchased it as configured in NJ. Shoots like any other AR but I thought it was way too inconvenient to have to break it open to reload. Then I found they have a device to load through the ejection port: > **[MA Loader for AR-15 | Mean Arms](https://www.meanarms.com/products/detail/ma-loader-for-ar15)** > > \#META-TITLE# Still I’m not a fan. ---
**Author:** ![brucin](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/brucin/32/35_2.png) [@brucin](https://njgunforums.net/u/brucin)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2024, 1:05am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/18 "2024-11-15T01:05:00Z")
> [@SmokenClays](#): > > Shoots like any other AR but I thought it was way too inconvenient to have to break it open to reload. It’s also way overpriced. I could build that for less than half that price ---
**Author:** ![SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/smokenclays/32/2247_2.png) [@SmokenClays](https://njgunforums.net/u/SmokenClays)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2024, 1:18am UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/19 "2024-11-15T01:18:45Z")
> [@brucin](#): > > It’s also way overpriced. For sure! That was just an example I don’t think it was that exact make or model so no idea what he paid. It was also during the brace restrictions so all he had was a bare buffer tube at the time. ---
**Author:** ![DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/user_avatar/njgunforums.net/dirtydigz/32/2609_2.png) [@DirtyDigz](https://njgunforums.net/u/DirtyDigz)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2025, 2:00pm UTC](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507/21 "2025-03-19T14:00:12Z")
Updates: Link: [AG Platkin Announces Consent Order Resolving Suit Against Gun Store For Unlawful Sales to Unverified Buyers - New Jersey Office of Attorney General](https://www.njoag.gov/ag-platkin-announces-consent-order-resolving-suit-against-gun-store-for-unlawful-sales-to-unverified-buyers/) Link: [New Jersey AG Settles 'Public Nuisance' Suit with Gun Store Over Completely Lawful Activity](https://www.news2a.com/new-jersey/new-jersey-ag-settles-public-nuisance-suit-with-gun-store-over-completely-lawful-activity/) [Next page](https://njgunforums.net/t/nj-oag-sues-2-nj-ffls-for-selling-rifle-ammunition-without-requiring-id/507.md?page=2)